Nature v’s Nurture

I just replied to a post from Coffeecup re Nature v’s Nurture and it got me thinking…

It’s such a huge area to tackle on one hand, and so simple on the other, so here is my story and point of view on the subject.

I was the black sheep in my family, I have 3 siblings who were always told they could do/be anything, but me - I was never good enough and wouldn’t amount to much - I proved them wrong on that score ;), though I still have self doubts about my abilities. The proof is in the pudding though I suppose and I have managed some great stuff (if I may say so myself).

I was also nagged (brainwashed) constantly about “What will people think?” eg, what to wear, how to act, how to sit, how to stand, how the house should be, how your children behave, don’t say what you think, don’t show your emotions etc etc etc etc etc - the list is endless!

I understand that this is the way the previous generation was, but by simply turning it around to “set your own standards”, rather than “having to meet others’ standards’” (who probably never cared anyway) , my life may have been totally different, such a small shift can give awesome outcomes. I am much better now than what I was, but I still have this overwhelming fear of peoples thoughts should I loose control in some way, it doesn’t have to be major loss either, just having to leave a trolley full of shopping, sitting down on the curb or leaning up against a shop wall to have a rest is something I can’t do, cause “what will people think”. I often see people sitting down on the side of a road for whatever their reason is, and I really wish that I could be like that, its not a bad thing, and people really don’t care, but in my mind…….. I know by thinking like this I am putting myself under so much more pressure than need be, but its a daily occurrence with one thought or another. If I was with someone else I would have no problem sitting down on the curb or whatever - how strange is that!!

I vowed that I would bring up my children with positive nurturing, and allow them to be who they were/wanted to be, help soothe their negatives, and really praise their positives. I believe that I did well with both my children and they have turned out well adjusted adults - don’t get me wrong they are not perfect, and I don’t want them to be either. I always thought before telling them off - will this help or hinder them? There were times when I hindered them terribly as any mother would understand but on the whole it was helping.

My daughter (Chloe - 24) thanked me a couple of years ago for being the best mum and supporting her so positively in everything she did - or did not do, and when seeing other friends relationships with their mothers she is very grateful she has me (she added that it would’ve been nice if I was rich as well, oops failed that one ) That was the best thing to hear and it melted my heart, but I was also proud of myself for having changed the pattern in the family lore, and to know they will not have to go through emotional baggage that I have.

My son (Rory), well he is a 19 old - need I say more I don’t expect to get any gratitude from him anytime soon, I know he is grateful by other things he says, but God forbid to actually voice any of those thoughts to mum. I know he is well rounded as all the girls love him - not because he is handsome or anything like that (which he is of course ;), but because he can sit down and talk with them on any subject for hours without any shame and he doesn’t care what his manly mates think.

Both of my kids will stand up and fight for their morals and values and happy to pass someone over if they do not have the same values. Me - I would have been too scared to voice my opinion. Secretly and ashamedly I sometimes feel a bit jealous of their abilities and wish I could have been as strong growing up, even now for that matter - I still worry too much about “What will people think?” but that was a term I never passed onto my children. My main term was “How would you feel if….?” to understand what it is like to stand in someone elses shoes for just a moment, empathy is a great trait.

I must say that I was a bit upset after my children were born and decided that I would not bring them up as a girl or boy, but both as children and let nurture make them into rounded human beings, when my son was only a couple of months old I can remember phoning mum, very disappointed that males are born males, and there is nothing you can do to change that!! but I still persevered My ex husband kept telling me that I was bringing up our son up to be a “girls blouse” (a sissy), that was a compliment to me!! I was doing right, males having feelings and emotions does not make them a “girls blouse”, just a much better person.

So I say nurture has worked much better in this generation, I hate to think who they would be if I had numbly carried on mum’s beliefs. They both still have their innate traits given by nature, good and bad, but they have been positively built on not suffocated.

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3. AP on June 18th, 2009 1:03 pm

   Great post! It’s so easy to fall into allowing the expectations or parameters that other people set for us to control every thought. Like you said, even leaning against a wall could be a no-no because what people might think. If we were to let go of these expectations that aren’t even ours, we’d have a lot less anxiety.

4. Ruby on June 18th, 2009 5:36 pm

   Hi AP, Gostemayorere and Dr Jacobson

   Welcome and thank you for your posts

5. Barry on December 7th, 2009 4:48 pm

   Your perseverance and introspect is one that shows true motherly care. You have learned how to deal with situations with a positive outlook. Many are not aware that they can snap out of it or find a way to get help.

Such A Great Feeling To Achieve Small Steps

I am getting rather worried about my specialist visit on the 26th, I hope I can manage it all ok as I really want to get this stuff sorted. A good friend is coming up from down south to come in with me, and I am really looking forward to seeing her as I haven’t seen her in ages.

On a good note, work told me that I had to go for a manual handling training for 2 hours last week, I freaked when she told me, luckily I had explained my agoraphobia to them at the first interview, so I told her my fears. This training has to updated each year for competency and I new I had to go, my supervisor called the facilitator for me and explained my situation.

I thought up all sorts of excuses of why I could not attent, but in the end I knew I had to at least try, so off I went!! I spoke to the facilitator when I arrived and she was happy for me to leave when I needed to. I think that just knowing I would not make a fool of myself by leaving early took away a lot of the anxiety. The session was for 2 hours and I stayed for 1.5 I was pretty pleased with myself. It also helped that it was in a small building with windows everywhere, and doors open to a courtyard.

A friend called me earlier this week and told me that I had to go into a small supermarket that is located right on the street and buy just one thing and then report back. I was quite put out by the demand, but appreciated the push at the same time. So on Friday after my shift I went in planning to buy something that was located at the front of the shop, I felt pretty good considering, so I made my way down the first aisle, by the time I got to the check out I had 12 items, I really surprised myself!! I started getting anxious and kept doing my breathing on the way to the check out, and was really really glad to be out when I got to the car, but I did it.

I go through such waves of emotions about getting over this, I get so sick of climbing this bloody hill only to fall off the other side (eventually - sometimes years, sometimes months) that I think I am better of staying where I am, each time before I have pushed myself hard to getting better but this time I feel like I’m so sick of fighting for nothing. But then days in the last week happen and I get a shot of positiveness to go on and fight again.

2008 - The Short Version

Gosh its been hard to think of whats been happening in the past year, I can barely remember what I did yesterday

I finished up at the night shift job as they were cutting down on staff, and then I went back working in Aged Care in a Nursing Home. It was very hard there having to speak with staff every day and find something interesting to talk about - since I do nothing! But I loved the work. After 6 weeks I started being nauseous every day (not from anxiety) and had to leave. But of course these symptoms made my body think I was having regular panic attacks again, and I went down hill very quickly.

I went for tests and found out that I had gall stones, but my doctor thought it was something else causing the nausea and pain so he wanted me to have an endoscopy to check for gastric reflux. But I couldn’t make it in to have the test, after being housebound again for 4 months I finally got the courage up to go in. There was no major damage there, so now I have to go in for further tests on my gallstones - in a much bigger hospital - so not sure how that is going to work, the appointment is on March 26.

I have found another job in Aged Care working part time in the community assisting the elderly at home with personal care, I am managing this fine, as there is no building I’m stuck in all day, just driving to each persons home and assisting for up to an hour, then back in my car - My Refuge Have been there for 2 months now, and still going strong.

I still can’t get into shops, offices etc but found last week a home delivery service for food shopping which is great (actually probably not great, as it is just using my great avoidance skills even more) but haven’t been into other shops for the whole year besides a small church food shop, local butcher and greengrocer that are not in a shopping centre, and these only on a good day.

Being a hermit at the best of times probably doesn’t help matters either, as I do not have any great inner urgency to get out into the big wide world.

Overall I feel much better now that I am working again, at least it gets me out of the house for a few hours each weekday. The rest of the time I pretty much do next to nothing. Actually that is not totally true, I have been recording free audio books for a site called “Librivox” and that has been great. They only record books in the public domain, so have taken part in some great golden oldies

I don’t want to bore you too much with my non activity over these months, so I will leave it here for now.

Its great to back online

Ruby

1. SARAH on February 26th, 2009 12:49 am

   I am SOOOOO happy you’re back

   x

2. coffeecup on February 26th, 2009 10:06 am

   Fabulous that you’re back!!! You were truly missed. We do worry what happens when folks stop writing, but to find you returned in such good spirits Ruby, is wonderful.
   

3. Ruby on February 26th, 2009 10:39 am

   Thanks guys

   Its great to be welcomed back so nicely. I’m really glad to be back.

I’m Back!!

Hi everyone

Firstly thank you to all the lovely comments left here while I was away.

I have been without internet for a year now, but I am back on line and looking forward to catching up with everyone.
I just spent an hour going through 700!! comments, most of which were spam, so I will come back shortly and give a quick update of the past year

Links

I am not ready to just sit and watch agoraphobia take over my life any more, and have spent many months searching for some good sites that can help me and that talks in plain language.
There is so much out there in cyberspace and I have wasted lots of time reading rubbish, but occasionally I find something great. I found these helpful or interesting in someway, so here they are:

Agoraphobia Resource Center

This site is written by Stephen who is a recovered agoraphobic and now has a masters degree in psychology. He has so much helpful information on his site, as well as a monthly newsletter with recovery techniques, and an e-book, its great to read from someone who knows what recovery is like. Stephen is also going to write a book and his blog for that is Panic Disorder Book Project

Beyond Blue

Beyond Blue is a national, independent, not-for-profit organisation working to address issues associated with depression, anxiety, bipolar disorder and post-natal depression. It has a key goal of raising community awareness about depression and reducing stigma associated with the illness.

Centre for Clinical Interventions

Centre for Clinical Interventions has numerous resources and great workbooks related to a variety of mental health issues.

depressioNet

depressioNet has a comprehensive resource of information help and a forum and chat room.

GROW

GROW is a community working towards mental health through mutual help and a 12 step recovery program. Small groups of people who have experienced depression, anxiety or other mental or emotional distress, come together on a weekly basis in all Australian states to help each other deal with the challenges of life.
There is also a similar group in the US:
Recovery, Inc.

Life with Agoraphobia Report

Life with Agoraphobia Report is by Dr. Joyce Davidson Post-Doctoral Research Fellow from The Institute for Health Research at Lancaster University has been conducting doctoral research on the experience of agoraphobia
and panic in plain english.

Mens Health Site

Mens Health Site is a great a great site for men covering various health topics.

Mood Gym

Mood Gym is an interactive training program with quizzes and workbooks that are saved in your profile.

Sane

SANE Australia is a national charity working for a better life for people affected by mental illness through Campaigns, Education and Research.

Still Here

I have had a terrible time sleeping lately, it has been so hot that all I have been doing is laying in bed while I am home and hoping to get enough sleep/rest to get me through the next shift at work.

It has been ranging between mid to high 30C degrees daily as well as a few above 40C degrees. If I am still at this job next year I think I may have to invest in an air conditioner. Actually its not so much the cost of the air conditioner as the monthly running costs, but its only for a couple of months I suppose, and sleep is very important.

I will write once I am getting enough sleep to be able to think again.

Ruby

1. Robert on January 30th, 2008 9:45 am

   Hi Ruby!

   Good to hear from you again! I hope that things are going well for you.

   You can have some of the cold, grey, damp weather we’ve got here, if you like! But, actually, I prefer the temperature not to go too much above 20°.

   Best wishes!

2. coffeecup on February 1st, 2008 11:25 pm

   Hi Ruby, what weather you’re having! It’s horrible here, the wind is howling and it’s trying very hard to snow. Then it pours with rain! Yuck! Cannot get warm at all today.
   Worrying over sleep sure does make it worse. When you’re lying there thinking that you ought to be sleeping, it just causes guilt and more anxiety. I’m awake well into the night all the time, but don’t have the pressure of having to cope at work. It’s hard to battle with panic when you’re very tired too. I emapthise with how you must be feeling. Come to England where it’s freezing! We’re all sruggling to keep warm at night!
   All the best, Steph x

3. coffeecup on February 22nd, 2008 5:59 am

   Ruby are you okay? Getting a bit worried that you’ve not been around for a while. Hope things are well :-/

4. shellie on February 25th, 2008 9:29 pm

   I just came accross ur page today, i am so happy to finally read/hear that i am not alone in how i feel, i actually cried. I have been off work for comming up to 7 months with this “anxiety” and just feel lost. i don’t see a light at the end of my tunnel and am so desperate to go back to work even though i still wake up with heart palpatations so strong that my whole body shakes and God forbid i should have an unexpected knock on my door (i can never answer it), i’m too panicy to drive and can’t catch a bus on my own so i walk for miles and miles to anywere i need to go ( i say walk but it’s more like speed walking with headphones and a hat on looking at the floor). i have good days every now and then but mostly bad days, and i can’t even start to tell you about the stress that my work have caused mr from bullying from a manager to witholding pay to not being able to “guarentee” part time hours if i return to work.
   please, were u as bad as me and how long did it take u to see the light?

5. Grind on March 25th, 2008 11:43 pm

   Hey Ruby,

   Haven’t heard form you in awhile but hoping that all is fine with you and your family.

6. Mental Health Blog Research Group on March 30th, 2008 9:28 am

   Hello, we are researchers from The College of New Jersey interested in gaining information on the views of authors of mental health blogs. You have received this invitation because you are an author of such a blog. Participation will involve responding to surveys about your mental health and blogging habits. The results are completely confidential. No respondent’s personal identity will be requested or associated with any set of answers. We appreciate your time and help with our study and as a thank you for participating you will be entered into a prize draw. If you are interested or desire further information, please respond to mhblog@tcnj.edu and be sure to include a link to the home page of your blog as well as your preferred contact email address. The survey will be sent to you via email within the next few weeks. Thank you in advance for your participation!
   –
   Mental Health Blog Research Group
   The College of New Jersey
   mhblog@tcnj.edu

7. James Collins on April 4th, 2008 11:36 am

   I think your site is great and would like to trade links with you. My site is about my personal fight with agoraphobia. Anyway, great site!

   - James

8. James Collins on April 14th, 2008 3:21 pm

   I have agoraphobia also and it sucks Ive had it for 3 years now and it doesnt seem to be lightening up anytime soon.

   James
   http://www.anxiety-agoraphobia.com

9. Phoenix on April 29th, 2008 11:26 am

   I just clicked on to this site out of curiousity and I read a little bit. I suffered from panic attacks and agoraphobia when I was 16. I continued to suffer through them until I was diagnosed with brain cancer in 1998. I have long since recovered and I am writing a book about how I survived brain cancer, the foster care system and a couple of drunk husbands and finally a bad assualt on me before my diagnosis. I am hoping that a lot of people will read my book and learn how depression ties into anxiety attacks. I will be visiting this site again soon.

10. Sarah on August 15th, 2008 2:39 pm

    How are you doing there?

    x

2008

Well its 2008 and I have plans of having a more positive year in various areas;

Number one is doing some social things to get me out of the house to meet some people, I haven't decided what yet, but I will have a look around in the local paper to find what is going on. I feel like I can face people now that I have at least something to talk about - work - cause I haven't done anything else worth talking about, and I am sure they don't want to hear about my Agoraphobia and Panic Attacks :)

I also want to spend some time and money in redecorating my house, I have made a small start where I have painted a feature wall, I want to paint the kitchen as well, have a new fridge and freezer on layby, and the next on the list is a new bedroom suite for me.

I also want to get back into part time study, still deciding between adding to my computer certificates or to add to my Diploma in Welfare & Disabilites, or maybe something just for fun, I will see whats on offer when the new courses are listed at the end of January.

I beleive doing the above things will automatically help with my Agoraphobia, so recovering further goes without saying.